tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post8295281420682028853..comments2024-02-11T10:58:23.271-08:00Comments on Reading to Know: The Bobbsey TwinsCarriehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08772667430500306088noreply@blogger.comBlogger22125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-59859531096234607972014-09-01T09:24:06.076-07:002014-09-01T09:24:06.076-07:00I think you are being too heavy handed on a classi...I think you are being too heavy handed on a classic piece of literature. Aside from the obvious that times have changed, the times were, in fac, the times. That was how it was. I remember as in the sixties people be "fat friends" it was a term of endearment. Regarding the character of Dinah, If I'm not mistaken wasn't Calpurnia in To Kill A Mockingbird, a black housekeeper? Or should I said African American housekeeper?? Children should read the books as they were originally written in my opinion. If you feel the values were so poor back then, use it as a learning experience. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-50892335395773105982012-06-02T11:14:03.775-07:002012-06-02T11:14:03.775-07:00One thing that must be understood, the original #1...One thing that must be understood, the original #1 story of the Bobbsey Twins was written in 1904. I have seen so many comparisons to Nancy Drew (which started in the early 30s) and Trixie Belden (which started in the late 50s/early 60s) They are 3 completely different eras. I actually LOVED the series as a kid, and had a couple of the pre WWI books in original format. I understand the sentiments towards blacks are outdated, but i truly feel that the author was putting Dinah and her husband Sam in a positive light (for the time) It wasn't meant to be prejudiced-just a kids story. That being said, i liked the 2nd and 3rd series best (both from the '80s) These aren't rewrites, but new stories with the Bobbseys as more of a crime-fighting team (a la the Hardy Boys or the Three Investigators) Those appealed to me more-my sense of adventure.<br /><br />P.S. Not that it should matter, but i want to say, I am black-so i am not being calloused about how blacks were treated-i just realise that it is a book from a certain time period over 100 years agoSeannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-58663775663576188082011-06-01T15:36:18.558-07:002011-06-01T15:36:18.558-07:00I should add that the family didn't outright d...I should add that the family didn't outright disrespect Dinah...she just wasn't respected the way I wish she could have been. Though they loved her, she was still very much a servant...and not just "help."<br /><br />Do you know what I mean?Annette W.https://www.blogger.com/profile/02498639468291720406noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-55310715190603485682011-06-01T15:31:17.518-07:002011-06-01T15:31:17.518-07:00Just found this post. I recently read the BT in t...Just found this post. I recently read the BT in the Country...an edition that has no copyright in it, but I believe said Christmas late 1930s or early 40s. I was thrilled when I found it at the home of my husband's grandparents...and they've let me have any of their old books that I want.<br /><br />Anyway, I was also repulsed by the way Dinah was written...the way she spoke, the way they treated her...all of it. And I didn't think I was for revisions, but now I can understand why they would be needed. However, I also appreciate that I can understand the time period much better.<br /><br />I actually found the story to be quite boring, too. This story focused on the younger children...but still.<br /><br />There was also the issue of children rolling a tobacco-free cigarette and starting a fire...using a gun...and I don't remember what else. Those I can also take into account of the time period. Even when I was a kid everyone had knives if they lived on a farm.<br /><br />Though I'm pleased to have such an old book given to me...and truly a children's classic...I don't feel the need to read any more BT.Annette W.https://www.blogger.com/profile/02498639468291720406noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-88755588174385443452010-08-23T13:33:47.539-07:002010-08-23T13:33:47.539-07:00Hi--
Stumbled across this post and enjoyed it. I...Hi--<br /><br />Stumbled across this post and enjoyed it. I am something of a Bobbsey Twins expert, I've read pretty much all of the books in original two series (in one edition or other) and collect original editions. So I'm very well acquainted with the--shall we say ante-deluvian aspects of the original editions. <br /><br />What makes them questionable is not that they have a black maid/housekeeper (plus her husband, also black, who is the handyman--Sam and Dinah live with the Bobbseys in a garage apartment). It's how this is portrayed. For one thing, Dinah's dialect is along the lines of "sho' nuff, Massah Bobbsey!"--it's VERY stereotypical. There's even a line where she jokes about how "back in Verginny" she used to "steal de wattuhmelons!" Dinah and Sam are extremely sympathetic characters but they *are* stereotypes. They are written with much more dignity and gravitas in the later editions. <br /><br />There are other stereotypes which are not so innocuous--in The Secret at the Seashore (the third book), everyone is looking for the younger twins and they come across a carnival which has a fortunetelling booth staffed with gypsies. The gypsies are described as liars, cheats, con artists and would-be kidnapers--there's a line about how "she pretended to look through some dirty cards in order to tell the future" and "'No, lady. Gypsy tell lady's fortune, then lady find them,' she suggested, with that trick her class always uses."<br /> It's very odd, there's a strong editorial POV in this section that is atypical for these book--it's almost a warning to the presumed child-readers. Perhaps the oddest example of outmoded attitudes is when the book is talking about Flossie's doll collection--she has like 10 of them, including Jujube, the "colored" doll that Sam and Dinah gave her. She keeps the dolls in a drawer, and separates Jujube from the others with a shoe box lid. Yep, you got that right--doll segregation.<br /><br />With all that there's an innocence that's enjoyable and I certainly enjoy rereading them (old-fashioned as they are, I like how Flossie is very quick to stand up to Freddie--at least they're not *too* sexist) but I don't think they qualify as classic literature.Clarahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01525833327080557061noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-13108351840877183982010-07-17T08:06:01.815-07:002010-07-17T08:06:01.815-07:00Thanks, all, for your thoughts and comments.
I th...Thanks, all, for your thoughts and comments.<br /><br />I think what I'm trying to say is this:<br /><br />In re-reading the BT,I realized it wasnt' really QUALITY literature. Fun and nostalgic, yes, but not QUALITY.<br /><br />If something is quality, I have no desire to change it or toss it out. It is what it is and it speaks to something in our history. (I am adamantly opposed to re-writing series to fit modern audience. Anyone who has read my diatribes about reading 1930's Nancy Drew should know that! I'm for original works!) But the BT just weren't very well written and so they raise question marks. <br /><br />If that helps to explain where I'm at...<br /><br />Which, btw, I did let my BT books go after re-reading them. It's not that I think they are inherently evil. There is just better quality reading material out there and I'd rather make the most of my children's reading time.<br /><br />That's all.Carriehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08772667430500306088noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-37749584766087196902010-07-16T22:37:58.945-07:002010-07-16T22:37:58.945-07:00While you're busy re-writing history and liter...While you're busy re-writing history and literature, don't overlook Mark Twain, Shakespeare, every fable or fairy tale of any time or culture ever written, Rudyard Kipling, ad infinitum.<br /><br />If you find an old snapshot of some long-forgotten ancestor, will you have it edited and tweaked to update their style and manner of dress? Will you have the depicted surroundings and behaviour "photoshopped" to eliminate outmoded or less-than-ideal characterisations?Neon_Javanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-52526462385639094262009-07-11T20:22:01.480-07:002009-07-11T20:22:01.480-07:00I just wanted to comment about the African America...I just wanted to comment about the African American nanny/maid you spoke of in the Bobbsey house. I am African American and I am not offended by the existence of books that portray AA in the 50's in these sort of jobs. (As long as the people are portrayed in a positive light as caring and competent etc... & there is no vulgar or racially charged language) That is just how it was back then. I think if we ignore how it was then we will be unable to appreciate how far we have come since then. During the 50's my Dad was working on his PhD and it was a difficult time for AA's. Now he's in his late 70's and he did not expect to see an AA president in his lifetime. I feel truly blessed that the history starts with a Slaves (great-greats), Crossing Guards & share croppers(what my Dad did before becoming a PhD) and ends with his PhD & my moms JD. So I'd just encourage everyone to discuss the past frankly, as we celebrate the present.<br />Thanks for your book review, I am glad that I read it before I read the book to the kids. Now I can talk to them about the past. <br />Thanks,<br />Kyle<br />Ma of 3 p's in a podtexasmcvayshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13672144667554705241noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-20560463934385875382009-02-05T16:27:00.000-08:002009-02-05T16:27:00.000-08:00I still have all my Bobbsey Twins books. I was alw...I still have all my Bobbsey Twins books. I was always hopeful that my boys would pick them up and love them like I did! I adored them and devoured each book and read them over and over again. My boys aren't interested, and it doesn't really bother me. If they want to read them, that's fine too. The situations were the norm for the time in which they were written. If anything, I could use it to promote a dialogue about the differences now and then. I understood that the books were written at a different time and didn't take them literally as what is normal. Political correctness bugs me to no end anyway. I'd hate to see them rewritten<BR/><BR/>I gave all my Nancy Drew books to my girlfriend's daughter. She loves them and I don't have girls. <BR/><BR/>I also have all my Happy Hollister books. I love rereading them too. I've offered them to my 10 year old (the one who loves mysteries), but so far he hasn't bitten. He might.Holly (2 Kids and Tired)https://www.blogger.com/profile/13075380878850295214noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-49258526278730374492009-01-24T18:58:00.000-08:002009-01-24T18:58:00.000-08:00Interesting analysis, Carrie. Last year I read 2 ...Interesting analysis, Carrie. Last year I read 2 Bobbsey Twins books to William. He enjoyed them and so did I. They are originals that I got from my mom. <BR/><BR/>I did edit as I read, though. I don't have a problem with them having an African American housekeeper. Or the dad going off to work. Basically my edits were to pronounce the housekeepers words with regular speech unlike the way they were written.<BR/><BR/>We'll probably read some more Bobbsey Twins. For me they were a precursor to Trixie Belden who then lead to Nancy Drew. I'm definitely interested in the re-written books. Though I find modern books are usually too modern for my tastes.Stephanie Kayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02976709475515458563noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-50831808074272679672009-01-24T12:07:00.000-08:002009-01-24T12:07:00.000-08:00I think the "fat flossie" and "fat freddie" would ...I think the "fat flossie" and "fat freddie" would bother me more than the racial overtones. <BR/><BR/>It's interesting that these books have been rewritten to make them "more current." In '1984,' they have a whole department in charge of erasing and rewriting history, so that the current administration appears to be infallible.<BR/><BR/>I'm not sure whether the Bobbsey twins are quality literature or not, but I question the idea of removing aspects of them that are evidence of our past as a culture.<BR/><BR/>(Is the idea of a black house servant really "past"? I have a feeling lots of minorities are still similarly employed.)<BR/><BR/>Anyway, I popped in because I've never read the Bobbsey twins, and I was curious. Thanks for the review. I'm thinking I'll stick with the Boxcar children with my kids -- even though they have a few oddities of their own!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-78854553072972391752009-01-24T00:17:00.000-08:002009-01-24T00:17:00.000-08:00I think there are books--literary books--that disp...I think there are books--literary books--that display the attitudes of their time and are worth reading yet because of the life-lessons and humanity they portray. I don't think the Bobbsey Twins fall into that category. They are formulaic and trite (and yeah, I read several when I was a kid, too).Karen G.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00680320370181357559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-45581889639436707262009-01-23T17:42:00.000-08:002009-01-23T17:42:00.000-08:00Interesting point about really good books not need...Interesting point about really good books not needing revisions.<BR/>I have warm fuzzies about the Bobsey twins from reading them as a kid, but I remember absolutely nothing about them. I guess they weren't great literature, but I think that sometimes, it's okay for kids to read light stuff, too.Rachelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01218157896853199246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-88999866651086409922009-01-22T10:32:00.000-08:002009-01-22T10:32:00.000-08:00By the way, now that I know you better, I still do...By the way, now that I know you better, I still don't understand why you don't like Freddie.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03789250398792504412noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-20822382159988850712009-01-22T10:31:00.000-08:002009-01-22T10:31:00.000-08:00Interesting!I think that is what makes a children'...Interesting!<BR/><BR/>I think that is what makes a children's book an enduring classic -- the fact that although there may be some differences, the main idea stands up (I notice words like idiot and stupid used that are considered the worst of profanity in homes today!).<BR/><BR/>I agree that the African American househelp isn't the main thing, but if it feels SO dated -- not classic, but instead unrelatable -- I say toss it.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03789250398792504412noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-12898807609307950482009-01-22T06:40:00.000-08:002009-01-22T06:40:00.000-08:00Great point about the Latino housekeepers, stephen...Great point about the Latino housekeepers, stephenie. Political correctness is ever evolving ... literature should transcend such phases. Unfortunately, too many people want the wealth of thousands of years to fit into the box that is the 21st century. Rewrite a story often enough and you write the story away.<BR/><BR/>Go Trixie, btw!!Noël De Vrieshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13461116221338023290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-65622244475377333602009-01-22T04:48:00.000-08:002009-01-22T04:48:00.000-08:00You know, I don't think I've ever read a Bobsey Tw...You know, I don't think I've ever read a Bobsey Twin story! From you post, about the Af.Amer. housekeeper, I don't think that will discourage me from picking up one of these to preview down the road. My own Dad, when he was a little boy in the south, had well to do parents and grew up with a "mammy" that helped around the house. I guess, if the housekeeper (no matter her nationality) is not being spoken about or to in a derogatory way, then I look it the same as those today who have a cleaning lady named Consuela or other Latino name as is prevalent in the area of the country I live in now.<BR/><BR/>That said, I need to check one of these out and actually read it. I'm sure it's amusing!Stephaniehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04660852009014295034noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-81781910499263449552009-01-21T14:34:00.000-08:002009-01-21T14:34:00.000-08:00I may have read one or two BT books when I was a g...I may have read one or two BT books when I was a girl; I much preferred Nancy Drew! It is intriguing how one's perspective changes...Lisa Spencehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12990706355525884593noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-61954162573614140932009-01-21T14:08:00.000-08:002009-01-21T14:08:00.000-08:00I am 62 years old, and loved the Bobbsy Twins when...I am 62 years old, and loved the Bobbsy Twins when I was little. There was another series that I think was called The Box Car Children about some orphaned children who lived in a box car that I thought was wonderful too.<BR/><BR/>Thanks for bringing back some long forgotten memories of these childhood reads. :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-32571334477664645142009-01-21T13:39:00.000-08:002009-01-21T13:39:00.000-08:00I read the Bobbsey Twins, but I much preferred Tri...I read the Bobbsey Twins, but I much preferred Trixie Belden over them and even over Nancy Drew. I don't think the non-PC stuff bothered me too much because I think even then that I realized it was from a different time period. I don't think I'd have a problem with my own children reading them, either. I would just make sure they understand the time period, etc.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-35108329852895320942009-01-21T09:54:00.000-08:002009-01-21T09:54:00.000-08:00I don't pay any attention to being politically cor...I don't pay any attention to being politically correct, in fact, I'm not politically correct. These books are a part of their time and should be read as such. I read many books form an earlier time period with my children and we enjoy them just as much as I did when I was a kid. I don't think they should be re-written, that is as bad as banning books. When I read them we either discuss the part that feels uncomfortable or I will edit on the fly suiting our families beliefs and values.<BR/><BR/>I also look at the author's purpose, for example a 1930s book that portrays blacks as not PC today. Was the author trying to be predjudice in 1930 or were they writing to society's norms in 1930? Makes a big difference to me.<BR/><BR/>In 75 years, people may be wanting to re-write books written today because they don't suit the future's values and norms.Nikki in Niagarahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13348586723780500367noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31647067.post-84120486051430925442009-01-21T09:19:00.000-08:002009-01-21T09:19:00.000-08:00I wonder if, as adults, we notice and are bothered...I wonder if, as adults, we notice and are bothered by these things much more than kids are. I remember reading books like that as a child, and while I could see the "political incorrectness" of them (or at least sense that there were features in the books that represented mistakes of the past), I never absorbed it: I seemed to understand that it was part and parcel of a different era and looked past it to appreciate the stories for the good qualities.<BR/><BR/>Slightly off topic, I never really could get into the Bobbsey Twins. It was as though the writer managed to create four characters who -- combined -- weren't as interesting as Nancy Drew :)Bhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09964373798194372154noreply@blogger.com